NOW it came to pass, when men began to multiply on the face of the earth, and daughters were born to them, that the sons of God saw the daughters of men, that they were beautiful; and they took wives for themselves of all whom they chose. And the LORD said, "My Spirit shall not strive with man forever, for he is indeed flesh; yet his days shall be one hundred and twenty years." There were giants on the earth in those days, and also afterward, when the sons of God came in to the daughters of men and they bore children to them. Those were the mighty men who were of old, men of renown. Genesis 6:2-4 NKJV (emphasis mine)
I've always wondered who the Nephilim were and how they came to be. For awhile, I was confused and thought they were perhaps some other creation that God made outside the Garden of Eden, but that just didn't seem biblical, so I've attempted to find the answers, that I'd like to share with you here. What the verses above suggest is that the Nephilim were actually the offspring of angels and the "daughters of man."
Of course, they couldn't be the angels that were still in Heaven, because in verse 6, we learn that there was evil rampant on the Earth, and you would think that if daughters of men and angels from Heaven reproduced, we would have an even godlier race. No, these were offspring of fallen angels- Satan's minions.
The reason I believe them to be angels? The term used to describe the "Sons of God" is bene elohim and a similar term bar elohim. This term- bene elohim- is used only three other times in the Old Testement: Job 1:6; 2:1; and 38:7 and refers, very clearly, to spiritual beings. Twice the reference is of those fallen spirits who accompanied Satan in his periodic appearances before the Lord in heaven.
Why would angels, even fallen angels want to reproduce with the "daughters of man" you ask? It's very simple, really, to corrupt the human race, so that a Savior could not come from them. That brings us to the reason for the Flood. God had to destroy the races that created the corrupt flesh. For they were also ungodly and evil. Our Savior could not come from that line. This was Satan's plan. To corrupt the human race to such a degree that a Savior that would defeat him could not be found. Isn't it wonderful, how our Lord saved Noah and his family, all to thwart Satan's plans. We have an awesome God. Praise Him Forever! If you'd like to learn more about this and have some time to wade through all the details, I strongly suggest this link: Notes on the Nephilim and also this one: Biblical Archaeology Society Online Archive
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but weren't we already as evil as could be? would the changing of our physical and spiritual bodies be too much for God to overthrow? i think if thats true, we have a lot of theology to think over. i agree that the nephilim were some sort of spiritual being, but i don't think i can agree with your inference that Satan knew or could thwart what God was/is doing. Satan has no ability past what God allows him. the difference is that Satan believes he has freedom and that's a lie that we've let Satan make us believe.
ReplyDeleteThe thing is that Satan knew about what God was doing in the case of a Savior, because God told him. He was there in the Garden of Eden when God said "And I will put enmity between thee and the woman, and between thy seed and her seed; it shall bruise thy head, and thou shalt bruise his heel. Genesis 3:15 NKJV. I do NOT for one moment think that God could not thwart whatever Satan tries to do. I believe that God can do anything and has control over everything. But he did give humans free will. Therefore, we have the ability to be extremely sinful. I grant that all sin is the same in God's eyes, but He forgives those that ask His forgiveness. And not those that don't ask for it. Do you see what I mean, in this way, it was possible to be more sinful than others. I don't know if that's making any sense or not, but I did not intend to infer that God doesn't not have ultimate control. I DO believe that He does. (By the way, the changing of our spiritual and physical bodies was not too much for God to overthrow. He did so with the flood. Saving the only righteous man to be found, and his family with him.)
ReplyDeleteOne last point I forgot to mention in my comment above. The fact of the matter is this: God gave Satan dominion over the earth. Therefore he does have considerable power. He doesn't have the power to thwart God's plans, but he does try very hard.
ReplyDeleteI reject the premise that humans have free-will in the way it is normally defined. I do not believe that humans have the choice to do good, based on the idea that we are dead (not sick) in sin (Ephesians 2:1-9). Without God first coming and affecting our hearts through the Holy Spirit, we will not choose to do anything but serve ourself (Romans 3:10-18). All good things come from God, whatever good we do is ultimately born in God and not at all in us.
ReplyDeleteGiven this premise, there is no one who is "more sinful" than others and even if there were, more or less sinfulness is of no consequence because sin exists in both. Its very existence is the problem, not the level of its existence.
I guess my main problem was that you seemed to make the whole event that God was doing to be completely reactionary. Almost as if God was like, "oh man, I've got to hurry up and do this or else everything I've worked for will fail." God does not deal with chance. Even if Satan had "ruined" the line of humans, there would be no real ruining. Obviously, God had more reasons than just that for the flood. I wouldn't claim to know what they are or why he had planned it, but I do not believe it was reactionary. God does not sleep, as to be caught by surprise.
God might have gave Satan dominion over the earth, but as my mom always used to tell me: "I brought you into this world, I can take you out." Through reading a lot of Old Testament scriptures, you get a picture of Satan that seems more like a pitbull that God keeps on a leach. God has a reason for Satan's existence or else Satan would not exist.
Job is an excellent place to start when attempting to look at the person of Satan from scripture. Literally, Satan doesn't even have the idea to tempt Job, until God gives it to him. I think we give Satan too much credit in this world. He is nothing without the One who gave him his power and he can do nothing without the permission of the One who rules all.
There is no event on earth that is out of God's control or plan. For whatever reason, for whatever end, for whatever anything, God is working out history in His own way. This has been the orthodox stance of Christianity almost all the way till the present.
Ok, I guess what I said did not make sense. I do not believe that God is reactionary either. I think that God knew all along that Satan would do what he did. That was just what God did for His reasons, to eliminate the sinfulness of the nations. I'm not as good as explaining the whole topic as some, which is why I gave the additional links. Perhaps you could check those out and see what they have to say? Then you could see what I was trying to say. :) I didn't go into as much detail, because there is alot! Anyway, I thank you for your thoughts. I also don't agree with you that a person is not able to be good without having God in their lives (or at least without knowledge of Him in their lives.) Every person from the moment they are created has a knowledge of God, therefore, one person could be better behaved than another, but as I said. to the human mind some sin is worse than others. Our free will comes in when we choose to either follow the promptings of the Holy Spirit or not. Certainly, God knows which we are going to choose, but He lets us choose. It's like a parent saying to a child: If you do such and such you will get a spanking. The child then gets to choose whether they will do it or not. (And the parent often knows before the child what the child will do.)
ReplyDeleteSharlene,
ReplyDeleteI am praying that I do not lose you as a friend, however, that scripture in erroneously taken to mean: The sons of God = Angels.
Not so, the sons of God was referring to the Sons of Adam, the daughters of men refers to the daughters of Cain. Luke 3:38 the son of Enos, the son of Seth, the son of Adam, the son of God.
Matthew 22:30 "For in the resurrection they neither marry nor are given in marriage, but are like angels of God in heaven.
Mark 12:25 "For when they rise from the dead, they neither marry nor are given in marriage, but are like angels in heaven.
Luke 20:35 "But those who are counted worthy to attain that age, and the resurrection from the dead, neither marry nor are given in marriage; 36 "nor can they die anymore, for they are equal to the angels and are sons of God, being sons of the resurrection.
Angels do not procreate.
Peace to All
"The LORD bless you and keep you;
The LORD make His face shine upon you, And be gracious to you; The LORD lift up His countenance upon you, And give you peace." '
Hi Kings Kid, you could never lose my friendship by disagreeing with me! Because I was not cerain about the origins of the Nephilim, I relied on information from biblical scholars more informed than I. I also relied on more than one source for my information. They were strong biblical sources. They also explained why the Sons of God = Angels. I listed two of my sources in the original post, so that others could also read up on should they wish to. Please read what they had to say, as well as the original translations of the words used to describe the Nephilim. Bless you as well, my sister!
ReplyDeleteHi Sharlene,
ReplyDeleteThere is nothing errant in having the Bible as our only source.
Did you notice in Luke 3:38 that Cain is deleted from the lineage of Adam? That Adam is called the son of God?
Also in Matthew 22:30, Mark 12:25, and Luke 20:35, did you notice that Jesus, Himself said angels neither marry nor are given in marriage?
Who married Adam and Eve? The marriage began when Adam “knew” (had sex with) Eve.
Gen. 4: 1 Now Adam knew Eve his wife, and she conceived and bore Cain, and said, "I have acquired a man from the LORD
Gen. 4:25 And Adam knew his wife again, and she bore a son and named him Seth, "For God has appointed another seed for me instead of Abel, whom Cain killed." 26 And as for Seth, to him also a son was born; and he named him Enosh. Then men began to call on the name of the LORD.
Blessings to you
Thank you King's Kid for your comments, and your bibical references. I do see what you are saying. However, the biblical thought that you are putting forth was not from the early Church, but rather Augustine and later Calvin and Luther. The sources I used that explained what the Nephilim were used the bible and the actual Hebrew and Greek text from the earliest bibles to illustrate how they came to that conclusion. I understand your concern, but I must still disagree with you. I DO agree that the bible is the final, only authoritative Word of God, but I don't think that the English versions we use are always the best in getting to the exact meaning of the passages. That is why I also have a Hebrew/ Greek Interlinear and multiple versions of the bible in my home. So that I don't just take someone else's word for it. Thank you for caring enough to want to correct me, even though I feel we must agree to disagree on this one. Blessings to you my sister.
ReplyDelete